Curse

Malganis · Dec 13, 2011, 05:39 PM // 17:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by drkn

That said, degen seems to become totally worthless in PvE (from player perspective), though it's laughable even now. But that's an issue to be addressed after the original update kicks in. Removing the '-10 cap' from degen effects in HM might do the trick - both allowing players to apply much more pressure, as well as making mobs with degen, especially AoE degen, much more deadly, requiring more cautious approach.

Go get hexed with something like Migraine + Conjure Nightmare or Crippling Anguish and then get back to me on removing the degen cap.

It hurts, especially when your monk gets hexed/dazed too.

I'm amazed that a "non-update" is being talked about this much. Then again, not really.

Daesu · Dec 13, 2011, 05:46 PM // 17:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiogoSilva

I usually use one PvE skill, fill my party with heroes, and without cons, I have been vanquishing everything without any difficulty.

So do I. And have you cleared HM DoA and UW with all heroes, and without cons?

They need to delete and nerf all PvE skills and take away ALL cons if HM is too easy.

Quote:

It's the contrary: why use crappy builds that rely on one condition, when we can bring much superior armor-ignoring builds?

Hard Mode, as it is now, nerfs armor-sensitive damage, and has no effect on armor-ignoring damage. This is a fact, not an opinion. The very nature of HM is the reason why most dominant builds today rely on ritualists, necromancers, mesmers and RoJ monks.

Most dominant builds rely on them because of a number of reasons. One of the main reasons is the limited heroes AI which favor casters. If assassin heroes AI is better, I would have prefered to use them. The other reason, is people are too reliant on pvx and dont bother to come with their own effective build.

I have been testing invoke ele heroes in my team and they seem to work pretty well even in HM too, so I dont see why eles are too weak in HM, especially if you bring a source of cracked armor and have pve skills to boot.

Cuilan · Dec 13, 2011, 05:47 PM // 17:47

I'm not the one who overlooked the 50 damage when I was the one who first mentioned it.

cthulhu reborn · Dec 13, 2011, 06:13 PM // 18:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

They need to delete and nerf all PvE skills and take away ALL cons if HM is too easy.

I would like them to fix para's and necro's a bit first after this ele buff, but yes I wholeheartedly agree with this.

I never liked to ideas of cons in any game. It just cheapens everything.

Xenomortis · Dec 13, 2011, 06:25 PM // 18:25

In what way do Necros need 'fixing'?

Skyy High · Dec 13, 2011, 07:22 PM // 19:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amy Awien

Anything will deliver Splinter Weapon, and scythes don't even need a skill to do it fast.

Nothing compares to Barrage + Splinter for a big AoE spike in damage on a large mob. You hit all of your triggers with one attack, so you get all the damage out at once, that's its advantage.

miriforst · Dec 13, 2011, 07:22 PM // 19:22

I would say rangers way before necromancers.

Acehole2006 · Dec 13, 2011, 07:26 PM // 19:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbo32

Feature Updates

Ensured Nicholas the Traveler and Professor Yakkington are well-supplied for the next iteration of their Tyrian adventure.

--------

What the hell?

Not sure if this has been answered as i gave up after page 5 on forum as it went on about ele update etc.

But im pretty sure although its a guess, it just mean that the rare material trader is gonna stock up for Linen which I believe is one of the upcoming zones seen as its repeating. I know it says Nic himself is stocked up but im still sure thats all it means. could be wrong

Amy Awien · Dec 13, 2011, 08:20 PM // 20:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyy High

Nothing compares to Barrage + Splinter for a big AoE spike in damage on a large mob. You hit all of your triggers with one attack, so you get all the damage out at once, that's its advantage.

Against healers perhaps, and only if there's sufficient follow-up. Barrage may hit targets that are less then ideally placed to fully exploit Splinter Weapon (with fewer adjacent targets) - especially in not-so-large groups - while multiple single target attacks have a better chance of using all 'splinters'. But Barrage does look better with all those yellow numbers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by miriforst

I would say rangers way before necromancers.

Would be nice, if just for the change.

The Drunkard · Dec 13, 2011, 08:42 PM // 20:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyy High

Nothing compares to Barrage + Splinter for a big AoE spike in damage on a large mob. You hit all of your triggers with one attack, so you get all the damage out at once, that's its advantage.

HB/VoS and MoP does, and it doesn't require you to go ranger primary or secondary.

drkn · Dec 13, 2011, 09:45 PM // 21:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malganis

Go get hexed with something like Migraine + Conjure Nightmare or Crippling Anguish and then get back to me on removing the degen cap.

It hurts, especially when your monk gets hexed/dazed too.

Oh, yes, please!
That might actually make at least SOME areas of hard mode PvE hard - cons/PvE skills or not.

Wenspire · Dec 13, 2011, 09:46 PM // 21:46

Barrage will have a larger AoE spread for Splinter compared to HB/VoS, I believe. Though, that has it's disadvantages as well...

Aeon221 · Dec 13, 2011, 09:52 PM // 21:52

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...5&postcount=52

Dear Arenanet. I told you to increase health and reduce armor to solve this problem in March.

Maybe you should just have me do your balancing for you?

Kunder · Dec 13, 2011, 10:13 PM // 22:13

Quote:

HB/VoS and MoP does, and it doesn't require you to go ranger primary or secondary.

The main advantage Barrage has over other AoE physicals is that it is ranged, which makes it a lot faster get off in a battle. Problem is that it is 100% reliant on a rit spamming SW, without it rangers do nearly nothing.

Barrage doesn't require you to go derv or warrior, don't see why either matters (though R/W for SY is standard).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aeon221

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...5&postcount=52

Dear Arenanet. I told you to increase health and reduce armor to solve this problem in March.

Maybe you should just have me do your balancing for you?

March? Others and I have been suggesting the idea since before EotN was released as far as I can remember. Anet has always moved about as fast as a frozen sloth.

instanceskiller · Dec 13, 2011, 11:13 PM // 23:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aeon221

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...5&postcount=52

Dear Arenanet. I told you to increase health and reduce armor to solve this problem in March.

Maybe you should just have me do your balancing for you?

Told them? You looked like you were talking to Xenomortis not Anet based on the link you provided, or did you expect Anet to read through every single post on that thread, or just randomly know to single your post out before looking at the thread? Secondly, you "told them" in March? Like Kunder said, the suggestion has been floating around for much longer, you are slow. The current guild wars 1 live team might seem slow by your standards, but you can't expect them to be at the speed they were at during the early guild wars days as their resources are now lacking compared to then.

StormDragonZ · Dec 13, 2011, 11:25 PM // 23:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acehole2006

Not sure if this has been answered as i gave up after page 5 on forum as it went on about ele update etc.

But im pretty sure although its a guess, it just mean that the rare material trader is gonna stock up for Linen which I believe is one of the upcoming zones seen as its repeating. I know it says Nic himself is stocked up but im still sure thats all it means. could be wrong

All those poor fools who stocked up on Linen only to find out the update meant:

- Nicholas and Yakkington are filling up their suitcases as they intend to go around the world one more time. However, why go the same route they did last time when they can go about it another way!

Concise: Random locations per week.

Daesu · Dec 14, 2011, 02:59 AM // 02:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by cthulhu reborn

I would like them to fix para's and necro's a bit first after this ele buff, but yes I wholeheartedly agree with this.

I never liked to ideas of cons in any game. It just cheapens everything.

Precisely! And these people are complaining that eles deserve a buff on one hand, but on the other hand they are saying HM monster hp needs buffing because HM is too easy.

I have been vanquishing with rangers and have 2 eles, let me tell you that eles are hardly the weakest professions in this game right now. And yet, I doubt lowering the monster's armor is going to have as much impact on my ranger's damage right now as buffing the monster's hp, meaning that it would probably be a net nerf since cracked armor wont bring the armor down below 60 even after the update.

Chthon · Dec 14, 2011, 04:38 AM // 04:38

Regarding degen:

People usually mean one (or more) of four things when they say "degen sucks":
1. Skills that cause degen suck because they provide less DPS for their energy/cast time/skillslot cost than direct damage options.
2. Skills that cause degen suck because their limited DPS-per-foe means they contribute little to forcing a particular kill.
3. Skills that cause degen suck because I have other ways of killing the monster faster by using a similar amount of damage applied over a shorter amount of time through direct damage options.
4. Skills that cause degen suck because my party is likely to kill the monster before the degen runs its course, thus wasting most of my potential damage.

Now:
#1 Is demonstrably false. For instance, Conjure Phantasm @16 is 170 damage for 10e and ~28DPS (presuming you've got 4 targets to spread it over), which is not out of line compared to most non-elite sources of caster damage.
#2 is true and is going to stay true.
#3 and #4 are both going to become less likely to be true in the face of a large monster hp buff. To the extent that the problem is degen not getting a chance to run its course (#4), or giving it a chance to run its course is a stupid voluntary decision (#3), this update will go a long ways towards fixing degen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

In what way do Necros need 'fixing'?

Much like dogs, cats, or especially rabbits, they are prone to overpopulation if left to their own devices. Once they become a significant demographic, we all have to endure stuff like this. This is Chthon with a public service announcement: Please, spay or neuter your necros.

Kunder · Dec 14, 2011, 04:52 AM // 04:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chthon

Regarding degen:

People usually mean one (or more) of four things when they say "degen sucks":
1. Skills that cause degen suck because they provide less DPS for their energy/cast time/skillslot cost than direct damage options.
2. Skills that cause degen suck because their limited DPS-per-foe means they contribute little to forcing a particular kill.
3. Skills that cause degen suck because I have other ways of killing the monster faster by using a similar amount of damage applied over a shorter amount of time through direct damage options.
4. Skills that cause degen suck because my party is likely to kill the monster before the degen runs its course, thus wasting most of my potential damage.

Now:
#1 Is demonstrably false. For instance, Conjure Phantasm @16 is 170 damage for 10e and ~28DPS (presuming you've got 4 targets to spread it over), which is not out of line compared to most non-elite sources of caster damage.
#2 is true and is going to stay true.
#3 and #4 are both going to become less likely to be true in the face of a large monster hp buff. To the extent that the problem is degen not getting a chance to run its course (#4), or giving it a chance to run its course is a stupid voluntary decision (#3), this update will go a long ways towards fixing degen.

#1 Your reasoning is false because taking 18s before you start dealing that DPS is insane. The first 6 seconds you are only dealing an average of 10 DPS, over 12s you only deal 15 DPS. Over the first 20s of a battle you can manage at best 20 DPS, and its not even focused on a single target so that you can force a kill. And 40E for that costs a large amount.

#2 Even if degen was uncapped it would still be weak compared to damage, especially damage after an armor nerf. If you ran a build that had Fevered Dreams and then put every damage-dealing condition in the game, you would hit 36 DPS. Spiteful Spirit does about 35-50 DPS depending on the enemy, takes up only 1 skill slot, can be echoed, and we still consider it a rather poor skill overall. Granted SS has a lower AoE range, but its the closest comparison in terms of AoE damage over time skills I can think of offhand.

#3 and #4 matter little when compared to the lack of beating the #1 requirement of PvE: damage. If #3 and #4 mattered at the moment, why don't you see people care about putting -10 degen on bosses during long fights? Because it is so ridiculously marginal for the extra skills required to do so.

Swingline · Dec 14, 2011, 04:57 AM // 04:57

Necros don't need to be fixed. I think they are boring but maybe that just means they are not the best choice for a main for me.

They have Curses with most Curse skills being a passive form of excellent damage through debuffs and damage support.

Death is just completely awesome and my favorite attribute line. Minion armies help take focus off party members and deal insane damage. Minion armies are so versatile that you can go full damage, full tank or a bit of both.

Blood is the PvP line. Its mostly meant to deal moderate damage with self supporting skill(i.e. life steal, life transfer). I have no idea why Spoil Victor is in Blood because it has more properties as a Curse skill than a Blood one. Blood is just that attribute with excellent balance but looks unattractive because of powercreeping other professions.

Then they have Soul Reaping which is the best energy management in game considering its been nerfed many times. It frees up skill slots on the skill bar and gives the necro access to more energy management, support and damage outside the other 3 attribute lines. This also allows them to be a damn good healers with increased longevity at the cost of not going higher than 12 restoration.